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Engine Stopped suddenly

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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Engine Stopped suddenly

Post by Manx69 on Tue Sep 03, 2019 5:47 pm

Hello Friends.  I have a 1989 CR Sebring with Ford 5.0 HO and 5-speed transmission.  While out driving, the engine suddenly died.  Prior to this untimely demise, there was one skip or significant hesitation about 5 miles earlier.  I thought it was that I may have been lugging the engine.  I got towed home.  Since i have discovered:
1. Engine cranks over smartly and fuel pump runs with key in ON position
2, There is fuel pressure in the fuel rack.
3. No indication of injectors firing.
4. No spark.
5. No 12V at coil red/green wire.
I replaced the TFI ignition controller before discovering no voltage to coil.  No point in replacing anything else until that is resolved.
Where is the ECU typically placed in this car?
What could be between ignition switch and coil to prevent 12 VDC to be measure there?
I don't know how the CR wiring harness melds with the Ford engine management harness so I'm a little lost about further troubleshooting
I believe I have the Chevette steering column and ignition switch.

Any ideas before I just roll it off a cliff somewhere?
Keith


Last edited by Manx69 on Thu Sep 19, 2019 6:48 pm; edited 1 time in total

Manx69

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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Stop

Post by Loren Tungesvick on Fri Sep 06, 2019 11:12 am

Crankshaft sensor failure is probably what happened. Somewhat cheap and easy to replace. When the sensor fails all spark and injectors will not fire.

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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Re: Engine Stopped suddenly

Post by Manx69 on Sun Sep 15, 2019 4:21 pm

Thanks.  I’ll check it out but I am skeptical.  All the Mustang literature says there should be 12v to coil from ignition when switch when turned on.  There is no voltage (actual shows 0.62VDC) at coil.  Same at what I think is the EEC relay on the red/ light green wire there.  On the Mustangs, there is a fusible link in line from the ignition switch to the coil.  I can’t find it or where that red/lt green wire merges into the GM ignition switch.

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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Re: Engine Stopped suddenly

Post by David V. on Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:14 pm

I've toasted my fusible link before (trying to start my previous engine right after it spun a crank bearing and seized). It emits a pretty visible puff of smoke when it goes off. I run a painless wiring harness, and the fusible link is located between the starter solenoid and ignition wire coming from the main fuse box. Even though you're running a different harness, that's probably still the most logical place for it to be. That being said, it would take a massive strain or short circuit to blow the fuse-link, to my understanding. It's more a symptom than a cause, so if it is blown, you might want to look for causes of a short circuit to avoid future problems.

Hope that helps

David
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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Re: Engine Stopped suddenly

Post by Manx69 on Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:29 pm

Thanks Dave.  Everything works except power to coil and EEC Relay.  Alternator light comes on, engine cranks nicely, lights, horn, etc. all fine.  The build instructions and wiring diagrams don’t match what I have.  They seem to be simpler system for a car without fuel injection.  Mustang drawings show power power directly from switch through a fusible link to coil and relay..  I believe there is good continuity between relay and coil so the problem is upstream from there.  

That’s where I get lost because I don’t know how wiring from steering column harness merges with engine wiring. Doesn’t seem to match coloring or numbers in assembly manual.
Do you know if there are any drawings/instructions for the fuel injected 5.0 HO?  I think it’s a 1989.

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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Re: Engine Stopped suddenly

Post by David V. on Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:35 pm

Others might be able to help you with the diagram, I'm running an old chevy engine. Off-hand though, if everything else is working at least you know power is getting from your battery to your fuse box. So fusible link sounds like the only thing between the ignition and relay. Starter cranks so ignition switch should be good. The fact that your injectors aren't firing makes me wonder. Either the ECU is not reading proper resistance in the coil and not firing the injectors, or something upstream is preventing both from triggering (more likely). Coils are cheap, so might be worth sticking a new one in just to eliminate a factor, same goes for crank-position sensor as others have said. That would be the first two things to try, as essentially your ECU controls both your coil and injectors, and won't want to fire either one if it can't determine engine position. If the problem persists the ECU might need to be re-flashed or might have fried entirely (Can happen due to heat or moisture, especially if located somewhere sketchy like in many kit-cars). Check under the floor-mats near the firewall, above the transmission tunnel, and behind the glovebox for the ECU. Those are the most-likely places.

Hope that helps, I'm a novice at fuel injection.

P.S. the good thing about sticking a new Crank position sensor in is, at worst if it doesn't solve the problem, you'll have a new one on the car and a spare old one to keep in the trunk for a quick-fix in case it ever does fry.
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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Re: Engine Stopped suddenly

Post by Manx69 on Sat Sep 28, 2019 2:46 am

So here’s the story.  There is a circuit board on which are mounted all of the fuses and some relays.  The terminal at the top fuse is where a black wire goes to the red and green wire in the engine wiring harness. The terminal failed.  The next fused terminal below it was also switched off of the ignition and empty.  Simply moved the wire and fuse down to that terminal.  I have no clue as to what caused the failure.

I verified power through the ignition switch but was not sure which specific wire went to the coil and relay wire in the engine harness.  Found it after lots of continuity checks in various parts of the under-hood and under-dash rats nests until I located it and traced it back to the circuit board.  This was a very miserable and time consuming job.  Many hours of uncomfortable troubleshooting and the such a simple fix.  All is now well.  Thanks to all who gave advice.

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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Re: Engine Stopped suddenly

Post by David V. on Sat Sep 28, 2019 1:32 pm

Glad it worked out! Now you can go enjoy that top-down fall weather Very Happy
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Engine Stopped suddenly Empty Re: Engine Stopped suddenly

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